In reviewing these videos one of our instructors remarked how this was an example similar to the movie “The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly” when Eli Wallach remarks after gunning down a would-be killer, “If you’re going to shoot, shoot, don’t talk!” We can apply that to all our use of force options, when it’s time to act, act! And use overwhelming force to win quickly when we are overcoming resistance. We never want to look like a contestant on “Dancing with the Stars” during a physical confrontation. Winning is the only rule, and we use reasonable force overwhelmingly, which reduces risk to the subject as well as the officer.
Food for thought.
20 comments:
this is all because no one wanted to put cuffs on him---cause if you put the cuffs on-you think you may get stuck with the arrest!! i've been to scenes like this many times!! Everyone is holding the offender but no one wants to put the cuffs on him till the squad that got the call gets on the scene! Its goofy! Officer safety is the most impt. factor--but no one has common sense to figure it out!!! Since its not a felony arrest no one wants it--in the mean time the bad guy could have easily battered one of the officers!! HOW STUPID!!
I would like to comment!
AS a FTO in 015 I have noticed that the training we receive for the application of the taser is POOR!!
Several supervisors not just in 015 have a bad habit either of hesitation or poor tactics.
I have learned that discharging the probes at a distance of 0-2 feet is ok when followed up with direct contact to the body of the offender with the taser itself.
I highly recommend that at all roll calls, taser operators discuss rolls of assisting officers must take. IE DON'T LET GO OF OFFENDERS ARMS !!!!
The taser is a tool just like any other tool we carry on our duty belt and in order to use it effectively we must train-train-train and train some more.
Thanks for reading just a blue shirt in 015.
I guess you could say they hot wired the lad?
Thanks for reading just a blue shirt in 015.
Tue Sep 01, 09:14:00 AM
Your input is appreciated.
Problem here is the bitch wife with the camera. Police are scared (and reasonably so) to be seen using appropriate levels of force because how the uneducated public will view it. He could have been head stunned (several times) but I would bet that the 2 coppers were thinking about the camera.
How about a post about the contract? tentively- informational meetings on September 10th and 15th- contract should be posted on the websit by the end of the week.
Could you let sergants know?
Great Post Sarge!
I just finished the Department's video training on Use of Force. Too bad I didn't see these two video or similar ones in the training. I would guess that these videos will be shown at the academy but will never be a topic of roll call training.
(The proposed contract)
VOTE YES!!!! It's a good deal.
-----------
NO, NO, NO, NO ! ! ! !
It is NOT a good deal!
NO RAISE for starters.
NEXT, there are at least 10 plus other changes to the contract -
ALL NEGATIVE ! ! ! !
The only bone that sergeants are getting is an extra bid spot for sgts in units like the airport and CTA.. THAT'S IT ! ! !
As far as the "age 55 deal"; it is ONLY TEMPORARY. After the deal expires in 2012, THE CITY WILL NOT AGREE TO RENEW IT!!!
In the end .. only about an estimated 100 to 150 sergeants will take advantage of the "age 55 deal". As for the other 1100 Sergeant Association members.. they get NOTHING worthwhile in this contract.
Remember, a decent contract is supposed to benefit the majority of it's membership.
Not just 100 out of 1300 members.
ONLY A FOOL WOULD VOTE YES.
What an embarrassment. Use your pepper spray and inventory the camera as evidence.
Camera or no you are still the police. This is a lawful arrest so MAKE THE ARREST. You told him he was under arrest and it's clear that he is not going to comply. Quite all the pussy footing around it and hook him up.
On another note, another poster spoke about how you need to put some space between the taser and offender. The closer together the prongs stick into the offender the less effective the taser will be. So if possible, step back a few feet. If not, like the poster said, go hands on immediately after the initial jolt.
The reluctance to cuff is clear in this video. It should also be noted how easily and likely it is for the officer(s) to sustain injury if the process is prolonged.
Note the pulling, tugging and you can see how rotator cuffs are torn and backs get injured. Also note, probably because of the video that the officers never simply stuck the offender.
wtf!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that guy should have been maced and cuffed in 15 seconds flat. how dumb were these officers? shame on them and shame on their department and this liberal country in general that make the police fear doing their job.
Off Topic
VOTE NO
I don't blame the unlucky copper on the bridge but these two pussies should be ashamed. And I don't wanna hear this shit about the camera. He's actively resisting which opens up a wealth of tactics to be lawfully used. These two were just scared. And if that is the case, either stay in the car, become a house mouse, or transfer to the fire department.
It looked like an arrest on the north side.
Mr. Southisde,
That was funny!
Both those guys should be fired!
What a disgrace.
Perfect example of how they should have rung his bell with a few hand shots to the temple. Let the tape continue, he was resisting arrest and use of force is appropriate.
Now he's gone and they look stupid.
I've spent about a week trying to prepare an inservice block and my review of Taser data has my head spinning.
Manufacturer says no problem (of course). Amnesty International says ban them (of course). American Medical Association says used right, they can save lives but, used improperly, they can be deadly. There are many reports of Taser related deaths and some officers have been indicted.
That said, in my day we only had a gun, mace, a baton, Kel-light and brains. We were trained that you didn't whack someone on the head unless you want to kill them because it could kill them.
My dilemma in training is where does the Taser fit in? Taser reclassified from "nonlethal" to "less lethal" but when is Taser use likely to be lethal? We don't really know and it's hard in "shoot/don't shoot" time frames to calculate. My guess is a hair below deadly force...maybe someone charging at you with no weapon displayed who might disarm you if given the chance but we're not quite there yet.
Policy? Phuck policy. Policies can't keep you from having "deceased" or "defendant" after your name.
I wish this was clear but it isn't. About all I can tell the troops is to keep up to date and if you use your Taser, you damn well better be right. Good grief.
35 year recently retired Cop here- for "passive resistance" I don't think Tasers are a good idea. With that being said, however, this was in no way "passive resistance". This clown was actively trying to defeat a lawful arrest.
Not to second guess the Cops who were there, but viewing the video he should have been Tasered early on, rolled over, cuffed, and taken away. Just my opinion.
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